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It may be that the maximum range of the I-Pace will only be achieved if every journey is input in to the navigation system. Imagine inputting the school run everyday :)
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One touch "favourites" selection can be set to the school destination(s). That solves that issue.

Satnav can hardly change the range.

The optimization comes from making the distance as short as possible. For EV use fuel consumption might be given a priority with undesirable effects. For EV optimization might get frustrating since the software might direct you on the shortest distance for economy but you might find yourself in stop and go traffic because EV use no fuel when stationary.

Not as simple a concept as it might first ear.
 

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EV battery packs currently weigh around 1,000 kg or a tonne.

Fossil fuel tanks currently weigh about 100 kg and usually much less storing about 50-100% more usable energy than an automotive battery pack.

Energy density in batteries is hopelessly diffuse no matter what numbers are bandied about.

EV can only be justified on the basis of moving vehicle emissions out of urban areas into the countryside. The story about Heathrow implementing an EV program to "reduce Nitrogen emissions" amusingly proves this point.

How much that matters to the average average consumer is neatly revealed by the abject failure of EV to achieve noticeable market penetration.
 

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Discussion Starter #163
Satnav can hardly change the range.

The optimization comes from making the distance as short as possible. For EV use fuel consumption might be given a priority with undesirable effects. For EV optimization might get frustrating since the software might direct you on the shortest distance for economy but you might find yourself in stop and go traffic because EV use no fuel when stationary.

Not as simple a concept as it might first ear.

For those that would like to know how a SatNav can indeed contribute to fuel economy and maximise range :

The new S-Class will feature technology that will integrate the navigation data with the car's powertrain technology. The regenerative braking is linked to the speed limit detection system and navigation so it can detect upcoming corners, within 1km, and prime the system to recover maximum energy.



Although the speed limit detection system isn't currently available on Australian models the company is still working on improving it to make it work in local conditions. A spokesman for the company stopped short of confirming it would be available by the time the new S-Class arrives.


In addition to priming the regenerative braking system, the system is also able to detect longer bends and allow the car to coast if it is more efficient.
The system can also detect undulations in the road and compensate for that to.


Strenkert explained that the systems requires no driver input and works undetected. Testing by the company has shown it makes the car even more efficient with the computer in charge, rather than a human behind the wheel.

"Autonomous driving would be more efficient," Strenkert said.

He explained testing with the current E-Class demonstrated the computer would be approximately five per cent more efficient but revealed the gap will be even greater when the new S-Class arrives.

While the new fuel saving technology breaks new ground for the brand, the rest of the powertrain is just as important to Mercedes.



A Route Based Operating Strategy was described by Jochen Strenkert quite a few years ago and I imagine that the i-Pace, in the same way as my Mercedes, utilises a similar technology.
 

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Discussion Starter #164
EV battery packs currently weigh around 1,000 kg or a tonne.

Fossil fuel tanks currently weigh about 100 kg and usually much less storing about 50-100% more usable energy than an automotive battery pack.

Energy density in batteries is hopelessly diffuse no matter what numbers are bandied about.

EV can only be justified on the basis of moving vehicle emissions out of urban areas into the countryside. The story about Heathrow implementing an EV program to "reduce Nitrogen emissions" amusingly proves this point.

How much that matters to the average average consumer is neatly revealed by the abject failure of EV to achieve noticeable market penetration.

1000kg Maybe in some cars but not the Tesla.


1,200 lb


The 85 kWh battery pack weighs 1,200 lb (540 kg) and contains 7,104 lithium-ion battery cells in 16 modules wired in series (14 in the flat section and two stacked on the front).
 

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Satnav can improve fuel economy for ICE and hybrids but not for EV, at least not in a useful way, for the reason I point out.

Fuel economy and therefore range for an EV is simply derived from how many miles the electricity is "on", assuming the driver is already intent on maximizing range. The other possible driver controlled EV fuel consumption factors have nothing to do with route choice. EV have a maximum possible range determined by battery capacity. Changing the route of an EV can have no effect on this max range.

For ICE powered cars the route choice can make a big difference in fuel consumption and therefore range.
 

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Picking up a single component of the drivetrain in isolation is ridiculous.

A Tesla Model 3 weighs within a 100KG of a Jaguar XE, while the Model 3 has much greater interior room, specially for the rear middle seat passenger. And they cost about the same.

The XE has a very complicated and heavy 8-speed transmission. The Model 3 has a simple reduction gear. The XE has an 100KG exhaust system. The Model 3 has none. The XE has a tremendously heavy, complex and inefficient (˜30% efficient) engine converting gasoline/diesel into motion. The Model 3 has a very simple (3 moving parts) 90%+ efficient, motor.

ICE vehicles currently have one single advantage - speed of refueling when that is needed in the middle of a trip.

Weight is no longer an issue with existing Tesla battery/chemistry.
 

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It makes perfect sense to make fun of a single component of a car intended to be practical that weighs over 1,000 lb. Just one part. That weight doesn't include a lot of stuff that also had to be there for the battery to work as a fuel tank: inverter, cooling system, crash structures etc etc.

If the Tesla Model 3 were tom have all the electrical gubbins removed and replaced with a small turbo diesel or petrol drivetrain and fuel tank the car would be vastly superior to its electric powered version, more affordable (maybe even profit making affordable) and still not a very good car compared to an XE.

And fossil fuel tanks when full weigh about 1/10 that of battery packs and contain much more energy which is if course why the range of an ICE powered car is so much further then any EV. That gap cannot be closed. As fossil fuel is used the tank gets even lighter yet the energy density of the remaining fuel is unchanged. Battery packs cannot be fully charged nor fully discharged safely, to do so routinely shortens their service life dramatically. The real world energy density of battery packs is significantly less than the calculated theoretical numbers. That's only one of the pie in the sky bs misinformation EV fans like to bandy about.

Tesla Model 3, as for all Teslas, fits a battery pack far bigger than makes any sense at all from an engineering perspective. To keep total vehicle weight down other aspects of the car are sacrificed. JLR could easily build a much lighter and quicker car for the price Tesla would have to charge to actually make a profit making the Tesla 3.

PS and the ZF 8 spd is no heavier than the 6 spd it superseded.
 

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I have now both read and watched multiple reviews of the I-Pace, and it definitely seems as a great car. It matches up well against the Tesla Model X, and on Tesla forums they highlight the interior of the I-Pace as being superior to both the Model X and Model S. Of course the I-Pace won't sell as much as the F-Pace and E-Pace due to the limited demand for electric cars, but I personally think Jaguar has done a good job with the I-Pace.
 
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