Jaguar F Pace wins World Car of the Year - Page 5
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  1. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by BMVIrep View Post
    My point is Jaguar and JLR are basically media entities, with a profile far bigger than the mundane reality
    I completely agree with this. I was trying to figure out why Hallmark/Jaguar PR got under my skin so much. Then it dawned on me. They were always spinning, always stepping over the truth, always talking as if their average customer was a clueless 1960s stereotypical divorcé.

    While for example the 911 and Corvette engineering teams hold technical gathering for their fans and share very precise data (e.g. track time between old and new models, exact weight of options, etc) the Jaguar F-type marketing team simply says ridiculous things like "perfect 50/50 weight distribution", "super light weight", "super sleek low hood", which are not only false, but insulting to the intelligence.

    Jaguar is always over promising, over selling, under delivering, and they have no alphas advocating for their products.

    It is very sad, really. The only thing worse than having mediocre products, is to have them and pretend they are the most advanced things on the planet.
    Hailing from: New England, USA
    Jaguar XF Ownership History: 2009 XF-SC(SV8), 2010 XFR, 2012 V8 Portfolio
    Looking For: Good Handling/Light Jaguar Sports Car and Off-Road Capable Land Rover

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  3. #42
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    Audi Q5, Merc GLC, facelifted Porsche Macan, Volvo XC60, Alfa Stelvio, new BMW X3, and soon new X4. But the F-Pace is undisputed 'World Car of the Year', right?


  4. #43
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    Surprised to read this about the new Ingenium engine.

    Around the new XF’s class-leading steering, ride quality and feelsome balance
    , its maker has clustered a spacious, well-finished and very handsome car.


    It continues to feel like an XF, too – one thoughtfully matured into a better all-round prospect.
    It would be a near-flawless one if Jaguar had succeeded in polishing the Ingenium powerplant to the same standard.
    For now, the engine is the only reason buyers have for thinking twice.
    In time, there may well be none.

    Here at Autocar, we believe this version of the XF has the edge over the competition, particularly when it comes down to the actual driving element, leaving Audi A6 and Mercedes-Benz E-Class in its wake, however the G30 BMW 5 Series strikes the perfect balance between able to cope and excel with spirited driving and the effortless cruising.

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  6. #44
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    Quote Originally Posted by pekem View Post
    Surprised to read this about the new Ingenium engine.
    Where did you read it? Well, in Autocar obviously, but what was the article about, and is it possible to read it on the internet?
    It's hardly surprising, that the most expensive XF is the best. I have actually tried one, an XF S 380 hp, when the new XF had just come out. I also found it to be a great car. I have never actually tried an Ingenium engine. In the XE, I've drive the old Ford 4 cylinder petrol engine.
    Kind regards
    Henrik Münster, Denmark
    MY2009 XF Premium Luxury 4.2 V8 petrol, lunar gray, dove leather.
    Previous: MY2012 XF Luxury 2.2 (190 ps) diesel, azurite blue, barley leather.

  7. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muenster View Post
    Where did you read it? Well, in Autocar obviously, but what was the article about, and is it possible to read it on the internet?
    It's hardly surprising, that the most expensive XF is the best. I have actually tried one, an XF S 380 hp, when the new XF had just come out. I also found it to be a great car. I have never actually tried an Ingenium engine. In the XE, I've drive the old Ford 4 cylinder petrol engine.
    I simply followed the links provided by:

    Quote Originally Posted by BMVIrep View Post
    Hyundai in UK now, too. Autocar admitting Jags don't always go for list, even in UK. When will the dam break on JLR coming to the party? Have they any cash?

    https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/i...35000-discount

    https://www.autocar.co.uk/bestnewcardeals
    The lower Link I think, “Our Verdict”

    https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-review/jaguar/xf/verdict

  8. #46
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    Alfa shot JLR's F-Pace SVR fox already:

    https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/n...suv-lap-record
    http://www.carscoops.com/2017/09/alf...o-smashes.html

    'This usurps previous lap record holder, the Range Rover Sport SVR, which lapped the circuit in eight minutes and 14 seconds.'

    - JLR Weekly lied about the previous 'Ring SUV record holder being the RR Sport SVR - see comments. Desperate. Blatant

    How will JLR make the 550PS V8 F-Pace SVR compete with the around one third of a tonne lighter 510PS V6 Stelvio QV?

    They won't. It'll be slower to 100km/h by up to half a second, and they won't even dare to put it around the 'Ring on an official laptime, as it would be 5-10 secs. slower.

    The F-Pace SVR sums up where JLR is in 2017 - heavy old platform and ancient, blitzed by a cutting edge 'Six' wheezing V8.

  9. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by BMVIrep View Post
    Alfa shot JLR's F-Pace SVR fox already:

    https://www.autocar.co.uk/car-news/n...suv-lap-record
    http://www.carscoops.com/2017/09/alf...o-smashes.html

    'This usurps previous lap record holder, the Range Rover Sport SVR, which lapped the circuit in eight minutes and 14 seconds.'

    - JLR Weekly lied about the previous 'Ring SUV record holder being the RR Sport SVR - see comments. Desperate. Blatant

    How will JLR make the 550PS V8 F-Pace SVR compete with the around one third of a tonne lighter 510PS V6 Stelvio QV?
    Let Sabine drive it. She can make a Ford Transit van go round the ring in record time.
    And if she doesn't have the time, try the Stig.
    Kind regards
    Henrik Münster, Denmark
    MY2009 XF Premium Luxury 4.2 V8 petrol, lunar gray, dove leather.
    Previous: MY2012 XF Luxury 2.2 (190 ps) diesel, azurite blue, barley leather.

  10. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muenster View Post
    Let Sabine drive it. She can make a Ford Transit van go round the ring in record time.
    And if she doesn't have the time, try the Stig.
    Or just do a McLaren, and claim your car(P1) has gone faster, without the need for tiresome proof.

  11. #49
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    Seeing (some of) the video of the Alfa Rome Stelvio made me rewatch the videos of Peugeot competing at the Pikes Peak hillclimb in the US and beating the record. The old video from 1988 of Ari Vatanen driving a Peugeot 405 TI16 is a work of art, and the car seems really fast. The new one from 2013 with Sébastien Loeb driving a Peugeot 208 T16 and beating the Pikes Peak record with a minute and a half is simply amazing. That was a fantastic car. 875 kg and 875 PS. That made me think. Jaguar needs big and powerful engines, but they seem to have trouble making any. They haven't launched the promised six and eight cylinder engines, and some people seem to doubt, that they will be able to. Then how on Earth can Peugeot pull such an engine out of their sleeve? They don't have any production car with an engine nearly as powerful as that one or even like that one (3.2 litres V6), so they can't just have modified one of their existing engines a little. And the Le Mans cars used diesel engines, that don't seem to resemble this one. I know, a racing engine is not the same as a road engine, but I imagine, you can't just take any old engine and adjust it a little. It has to be a pretty good and efficient engine.
    Kind regards
    Henrik Münster, Denmark
    MY2009 XF Premium Luxury 4.2 V8 petrol, lunar gray, dove leather.
    Previous: MY2012 XF Luxury 2.2 (190 ps) diesel, azurite blue, barley leather.

  12. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Muenster View Post
    That made me think. Jaguar needs big and powerful engines, but they seem to have trouble making any. They haven't launched the promised six and eight cylinder engines, and some people seem to doubt, that they will be able to. Then how on Earth can Peugeot pull such an engine out of their sleeve?
    Peugeot doesn't get one-tenth of the promotion JLR gets in the global media, especially UK/US press, yet actually it is a much, much bigger company, and its technological expertise has always been very "French" - very good, perhaps not quite up to the global leaders of the Germans and perhaps Japanese - but certainly very good in the real world - affordable cars, high mass-production, with Ford/Ford of Europe basically piggybacking on Peugeot for its diesels, from the mid 90s till very recently. Their engine-making knowhow is very high.

    By contrast, JLR's engine knowhow was and is basically non-existent, with the end of engine-making at Jaguar 20 years ago, and at Land Rover almost 15 years ago, and even then Land Rover's knowhow was basically spin-offs of Perkins' 80s direct injection 'Prima' diesel tech. That is why the 'turning back on the taps' for Ingenium from 2010 has been so problematic to say the least, as there was no body of people and corporate knowledge to go to.

    Back to the F-Pace: the coming 575PS SVR will not have 575PS, but around low 500s hp, and with its weight penalty, it cannot compete with even the modern 6s from Ferrari/Alfa or VAG's new excellent 2.9-litre V6 biturbo, which produces over 500hp real in the new Panamera - massively understated:

    0-100 km/h in 4.2s to shift a 2 tonne plus car with '440PS' https://www.flickr.com/photos/dedeth...7687232062864/

    That is why the likes of the SVR F-Pace needs a new engine, VAG's V6 ideally, but that won't happen now obviously, but Ford's 3.5-litre V6 EcoBoost producing around 600hp would do.

 

 

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