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E-Pace is said to be Mild Hybrid

9K views 49 replies 8 participants last post by  jagular 
#1 ·
Now this would be a game changer if it is delivered at that price in 2018, the date a Jaguar designer tells me it is slated for.

As a style design I would buy this and Tesla would struggle with their model 3 to win me over.


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#2 ·
Now this would be a game changer if it is delivered at that price in 2018, the date a Jaguar designer tells me it is slated for.

As a style design I would buy this and Tesla would struggle with their model 3 to win me over.
No way JLR will build more E Pace than F Pace. The E Pace will be the smallest sales volume, behind the XJ even.

You'll have to move to China or California to find one.....
 
#7 ·
The E Pace won't be a hybrid. The E Pace won't take sales away from Tesla.

Trust the English to name their EV with an i and their smaller SUV with an E. Because E comes before F even if it comes after and E is smaller than F because it comes earlier in the alphabet.....
 
#9 ·
#11 ·
Just compare the nightmarish future maintenance needs of these "mild hybrid" vehicles, with the near zero maintenance requirements of a full EV.

One is an engineering and maintenance nightmare (imagine your local garage fixing one), the other is the pinnacle of automotive engineering elegance and simplicity. One will disappear from market after a very short transitional period. The other will endure as the future or automotive transportation.
 
#12 ·
Not really. The Continental system, as fitted to the Renault Scenic, is just a fancy starter motor - unlike the more complex 'e-MHEV' system illustrated in the JLR concept above - with a belt driving the crankshaft pulley instead, a small lithium battery and software.

If Renault is charging £1,000 extra, it obviously costs no more than this.

Compare that to a BEV, with a ~35kWh battery costing £10k. You can buy a lot of 4-cylinder engine for that money, with ~ £500 mild hybrid kit strapped on.

That's the point, Baron, mild hybrids will proliferate because they are much cheaper, cheaper too now than an RDE-compliant diesel in a small ~£10-15k car, and they allow makers to meet 2020 95g/km CO2 fleet requirement, as was the plan a few years ago with (non-RDE compliant) diesel.
 
#13 ·
I have no doubt that mild-hybrids will proliferate. Just like smaller turbo charged petrols have proliferated.

However, there is no free launch. The cost of maintaining these vehicles out of warranty will be horrendous.

Make no mistake. Maintaining a similar horsepower Turbo is more expensive than the same hp that is NA. And maintaining a turbo + mild hybrid is again more expensive/complex than maintaining a NA engine.

I'll buy a NA engine every time I can vs the heat bucket forced induction and hybrid mess.

The real evolution is going from NA large petrol engines to EV. Everything else in between (small turbos, diesels, hybrids) is just an evolutionary dead-end.
 
#14 ·
I have no doubt that mild-hybrids will proliferate.
3 already, Renault Scenic, Facelifted S-Class, and new Audi A8(D5):

'All five engines operate in conjunction with a belt alternator starter (BAS), which is the nerve center of the 48-volt electrical system. This mild hybrid technology (MHEV, mild hybrid electric vehicle) enables the car to coast with the engine switched off, and to restart smoothly. It also has an extended start/stop function and an energy recovery output of up to 12 kW. The combined effect of these measures is to bring down the fuel consumption of the already efficient engines even further – by as much as 0.7 liters (0.2 US gal) per 100 kilometers (62.1 mi) in real driving conditions.'

High time for JLR to issue another press release!
 
#17 ·
Well now we know.
Mild Hybrid :confused:

new Jaguar E-PACE has set an official GUINNESS WORLD RECORDS™ title during its world premiere. The compact performance SUV leapt into the record books with a 15.3 metre-long jump complete with a 270-degree corkscrew-like ‘barrel roll’.Demonstrating the agility, precision and performance of Jaguar’s newest SUV, the feat was the final test for E-PACE after 25 gruelling months of work across four continents to ensure extreme durability and that it lived up to Jaguar’s Art of Performance philosophy.

The Jaguar E-PACE is a five-seat, compact SUV that packs the design and performance of a Jaguar sports car into a spacious, practical and connected all-wheel-drive vehicle.
Trademark Jaguar driving dynamics and design put the brand’s sports car DNA in a practical design packed with advanced technologies to keep you connected.

The E-PACE is the newest member of Jaguar’s SUV family, joining the ground-breaking all-electric I-PACE Concept and the 2017 World Car of the Year, the Jaguar F-PACE – itself launched with a spectacular GUINNESS WORLD RECORDS™ setting loop-the-loop in 2015.

The exterior design is inspired by the Jaguar F-TYPE sports car and characterised by the distinctive Jaguar grille, muscular proportions, short overhangs and powerful haunches that give the E-PACE a bold and purposeful stance, instantly communicating dynamic agility.

Jaguar sports car DNA is also evident in the fast sweep of the roofline and the distinctive side window graphic.

Ian Callum, Director of Design, Jaguar, said: “Established Jaguar design principles ensure the E-PACE is immediately recognisable as the sports car of its class.

Our new compact SUV combines the interior space, connectivity and security that families expect with the kind of proportions, purity of design and performance not usually associated with such a practical vehicle”

The E-PACE completed its world record jump at ExCeL in London – one of only a handful of venues in the UK big enough to accommodate the 160-metre run-up and run-off vital for the 15-metre leap.
Behind the wheel was stunt driver Terry Grant, who has completed stunts on many film sets and holds an impressive 21 GUINNESS

WORLD RECORDS™ titles.

Terry Grant, Stunt Driver, said: “As far as I am aware no production car has ever cleanly completed a bona-fide barrel roll and therefore it has always been an ambition of mine to perform one ever since I was a boy. After driving the Jaguar F-PACE in the record-breaking loop-the-loop, it has been amazing to help launch the next chapter of the PACE family in an even more dramatic dynamic feat.”

Unsurprisingly, the barrel roll is not one to be tried at home; months of testing and analysis were completed to fine-tune the stunt, including achieving precisely the correct speed of run-up. The ramps were modelled extensively using CAD before any jumps took place. Terry experienced a G-Force of 5.5 during the 270 degree twist, and required a 160-metre run up to hit the air at the correct speed.

Guinness World Records adjudicator Pravin Patel said: “This amazing feat really was a sight to behold. While I’ve seen the barrel roll stunt in film, witnessing this incredible feat in real life was something pretty special. Congratulations to Terry and Jaguar for setting another epic Guinness World Records title.”

The reveal of the E-PACE was followed by a spectacular musical performance by Pete Tong & The Heritage Orchestra who presented the now legendary Ibiza Classics. As a celebration of the new Jaguar E-PACE, Pete collaborated with singer-songwriter Raye to perform “You Don’t Know Me” by Jax Jones - a hit that features Raye that has over 230 million plays on Spotify and over 130 million You Tube views.

Pete Tong said: "I've been working with the Heritage Orchestra for the past couple of years but this is the first time I've been involved in something like this, it's very exciting and I'm glad to be a part of it! Jaguar breaking the Guinness World Record for the barrel roll was mind-blowing. To see this stunt recreated right in front of us was mind-blowing. This creative approach to revealing the new Jaguar E-PACE was the inspiration behind the collaboration between myself and Raye and we are now planning to put the track on my new album."


The GUINNESS WORLD RECORDS™ title holding- Jaguar E-PACE reveal can be viewed here:
https://youtu.be/9yatAJVA_4E


E-PACE: Connected, Intelligent, Agile, Responsive


The Jaguar E-PACE is connected and intelligent. The 10-inch touchscreen comes as standard and connects customers to their favourite apps, including Spotify. Jaguar Land Rover’s InControl system allows you to keep the vehicle secure by tracking it on your smartphone, automatically alerts the emergency services in case of an accident and allows you to check fuel levels and mileage remotely via a smartphone or smar****ch. Customers can warm up the car, cool it down and even start it remotely using InControl.

Digital connectivity can be found throughout the cabin, ready for every need of the modern family. There are up to four 12-volt charging points and five USB connections as well as a 4G Wi-Fi hotspot for up to eight devices.

The E-PACE has exceptional interior space for its class. The compact SUV can seat five in absolute comfort with generous rear legroom. The large luggage space is made possible by the vehicle’s sophisticated Integral Link rear suspension architecture and can fit a pushchair, a set of golf clubs and a large suitcase

Configurable Dynamics gives the driver even more control with individual settings for the throttle, automatic transmission, steering, and, where fitted, the Adaptive Dynamics suspension system. Adaptive Dynamics senses driver input, body and wheel movements and pre-emptively loads the suspension and chassis and adjusts the damping for improved roll control and agility in all conditions.
E-PACE is available with a range of powerful and efficient Ingenium petrol and diesel engines.

The 300PS Ingenium petrol turbo engine powers the sporting SUV from 0-60mph in just 5.9 seconds (6.4 seconds for the 0-100km/h sprint) before reaching an electronically-limited top speed of 151mph. For customers who want the ultimate efficiency, the front-wheel drive 150PS Ingenium diesel delivers CO2 emissions of 124g/km.

Alan Volkaerts, Vehicle Line Director, Jaguar E-PACE, said: “The Jaguar E-PACE provides the best of both worlds: Jaguar sports car dynamics with compact SUV practicality.

The latest addition to our growing PACE family provides comfort, interior space and leading stowage solutions allied to engaging handling and Jaguar Land Rover’s latest Ingenium petrol and diesel engines.”


E-PACE’s Active Driveline all-wheel-drive system is a technological first for Jaguar. The intelligent set-up combines phenomenal traction with Jaguar’s unmistakable rear-wheel-drive character. The system’s torque-biasing capability delivers optimal stability, dynamics and fuel efficiency in all conditions and all weathers.

The E-PACE features the very latest safety and driver assistance technologies. A stereo camera underpins the advanced Autonomous Emergency Braking system, which also provides pedestrian detection and supports Lane Keep Assist and Traffic Sign Recognition, as well as the Intelligent Speed Limiter and Driver Condition Monitor systems. Front and rear parking aids are standard.

The camera also combines with the electric power assisted steering system and rear radars to deliver a Blind Spot Assist function, to help reduce the risk of sideswipe collisions on multi-lane roads. A new Forward Traffic Detection system also warns drivers of approaching vehicles at junctions where visibility is restricted. Advanced active safety features include a pedestrian airbag, which deploys from beneath the trailing edge of the bonnet in the event of a collision.


The E-PACE is the first Jaguar to feature the company’s next-generation Head-Up Display technology. The advanced display can project up to 66 per cent more information onto the windscreen using large, full-colour graphics with enhanced clarity. Essential information including vehicle speed and navigation directions are in full view at all times, with alerts and updates for the infotainment, safety and convenience features all projected directly into the driver’s eyeline – reducing the need to look away from the road.


An optional 12.3-inch full colour digital instrument panel and choice of two premium audio systems developed with Meridian put the E-PACE on a par with vehicles from the class above when it comes to interior technology.

The E-PACE is also available with Jaguar’s innovative wearable Activity Key. The waterproof and shockproof wristband has an integrated transponder, allowing the driver to lock the main key inside the vehicle when enjoying outdoor pursuits such as running or cycling.

Whenever the Activity Key is activated, by holding the wristband up to the upper edge of the number plate surround on the tailgate, any conventional key fobs left inside the vehicle are disabled.

The strong chassis also allows owners to tow up to 1,800kg (braked), ideal for customers who use their E-PACE for both business and pleasure.
For further detail on the Jaguar E-PACE including the in-depth technical story and specifications please visit http://media.jaguar.com/en-gb
 
#18 ·
E-Pace is said to be...

a Mazda? a Kia? a Hyundai? a Suzuki Swift that's let itself go? a Joque? a dogs dinner?



JLR say the reason they're making this thing in Austria and not Halewood is because they haven't the capacity for the 100,000+ units. Yep, these clowns do believe their own propaganda.

It's being made by Magna because Halewood is a joke.
 
#22 ·
New E-pace in full view..



I quite like the look of it more especially the interior, it appears nicer quality than the recent saloons , and a nicer style I think. These pictures from NetCarShow app. Also on Jag website as a configurator of a different type. Thoughts ?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 
#26 ·
I quite like the look of it more especially the interior, it appears nicer quality than the recent saloons , and a nicer style I think. Thoughts ?
That's because the dash is the Evoque's, based on the 2006 Freelander's, gussied up for the Range Rover moniker in 2007-2009, whereas 'New Gen' Jag, starting with the XE, was fully conceived under Tata's purse strings in 2011-2013, with consequent sub-Kia quality.

That's why everyone now says the last decent Jag interior is the XJ's, which was conceived 2007-8.

However, the E-Pace's dash looks like it has a wart growing on it, due to the nasty implementation of its new Head up display, and the brace strut on the lower dash, supposedly for an F-Pace connotation, looks daft. And like the Evoque, the E-Pace has a non-opening sunroof.
 
#23 ·
E Pace is said to be a likely candidate for Jaguar's first hybrid drive which is not at all the same thing.

Can the the new compact sedan be far behind? AWD based on FWD transverse drivetrain with strut front and multilink rear.

What will they call the baby sedan? The X Type?
 
#28 ·
E Pace is said to be a likely candidate for Jaguar's first hybrid drive which is not at all the same thing.
- they trailed a mild hybrid - no show. An integrated starter-generator is beyond JLR's engineers? Yes the kit is easy, just bolt on the new Continental/Bosch/... motor, but the software is a different matter, and it's this which is killing JLR, as they haven't got the software engineering talent. Suppliers can only do so much, you have to have your own people to integrate the 'black box'.

Can the the new compact sedan be far behind? AWD based on FWD transverse drivetrain with strut front and multilink rear.

What will they call the baby sedan? The X Type?
So the XE, XF and XJ aren't selling, into a sector that is collapsing outside of China, and you want them to produce another saloon?

The Germans do it - produce a 3-box compact saloon - because they already produce a C-segment hatchback - A3, A-Class etc - to which adding a booted version is relatively little cost, and gains sales in China, and some in Europe and the US.

JLR has no suitable platform. Producing an Audi A3 saloon competitor from the 2006 Ford/Volvo 'CD3/P3' platform, which begat the min. 1,800 kilo 4WD RR Evoque, would be the engineering challenge of the century.

Volvo will later this year launch their new '40' series cars, with the brand new 'CMA' platform, part of the £10bn investment by Geely since 2010. That's what's required to make an VW group MQB-platformed Audi A3 competitor.
 
#24 ·
There is no reason why they can't sell 100K units/year. The buying public, particularly in Europe, woke up 2 decades behind America to the advantages of SUVs/CUVs. Seems like whatever can be built is bought
 
#29 ·
Even if they did - sell 100k - it would cannibalise Land Rover's sales - the Evoque and D.Sport. You seem to forget that JLR has moved to pretty much combined dealer sites, especially in the US, and a punter seeing an Evoque against an E-voque will 95% of the time go for the Range Rover branding, plus the Evoque has some design quality, whereas the E-voque is just plainly a brand engineering exercise, not a million miles from British Leyland in the 70s.

Yes i know the E-Pace has the D.Sport's multi-link rear susp. instead of the Evoque's strut, but how may forty year old women will know or care? The Evoque will get the read-across D.sport suspension at its next facelift or 'all-new' version next year? anyway.

You under-estimate the power of the Range Rover brand - the only thing of worth at JLR - and over-estimate the worth of Jaguar's, which resides in the 50s and 60s, and appeals only to 60+ year old mainly males regardless of JLR's attempts to move it down and feminise it.
 
#27 ·
Jaguar wouldn’t say if their expected best seller,the E-Pace, will be electrified.







Nick Gibbs

Automotive News Europe
July 13, 2017 21:00 CET

LONDON

Jaguar predicts that its new E-Pace compact premium SUV will become its top-seller, overtaking the larger F-Pace crossover because it will more attainable than its big brother.


New E-Pace compact premium SUV will become its top-seller, overtaking the larger F-Pace crossover because it will more attainable than its big brother.

“It will be less expensive and I think the demographic will be wider,” Jaguar design boss Ian Callum said here Thursday when discussing why he believes E-Pace demand will exceed that for the F-Pace after deliveries of the new SUV start early next year.


Finbar McFall, Jaguar Land Rover's global product marketing director, told reporters at the E-Pace debut that the company expects 80 percent of customers to be new to the Jaguar brand.

Jaguar’s smallest SUV, which will compete against BMW X1, Audi Q3, Mercedes-Benz GLA and forthcoming Volvo XC40, will start at 28,500 pounds in its home market and 34,950 euros in the rest of Europe.
By comparison, the F-Pace starts at 34,730 pounds in the UK and 43,560 euros in Germany.

The F-Pace was Jaguar’s No. 1 seller during its fiscal year that ended in March. With a volume of 67,955 units, the F-Pace accounted for 39 percent of Jaguar’s overall sales of 172,848 during the period.

McFall said the F-Pace is the fastest-selling Jaguar in the brand's history with more than 80,000 sold globally since April of last year.


Analyst firm IHS Markit predicts the E-Pace will help push Jaguar’s annual global sales above 250,000 in 2019, up from a low of 42,952 in 2010.

The new E-Pace will be built for all global markets except China by Magna Steyr in Graz, Austria.

The contract manufacturer will also start building the I-Pace early next year. Outsourcing production helps JLR cope with its lack of capacity in the UK, operations director Alan Volkaerts said. “Our UK plants are full,” he said.


The E-Pace will also be built in Changshu, China, at a plant operated with joint venture partner Chery Automobile.
The long-wheelbase version of the Jaguar XF, Range Rover Evoque and Land Rover Discovery Sport are also produced at the China factory, which is JLR's only production site in the country.



Maximized cabin space

The E-Pace is underpinned by an adapted version of the Range Rover Evoque’s steel transverse-engine platform.

That architecture was chosen over the rear-wheel-drive aluminum platform used by the XE, XF and F-Pace to help Jaguar make the cabin as large as possible.

“We’ve worked very hard to get space into the interior,” Callum said. The rear suspension is adapted from the XE while the roof, tailgate and hood are made from aluminum to help reduce weight.


The entry E-Pace will be front-wheel drive while higher-spec models get all-wheel drive.
The standard all-wheel-drive system delivers torque to the rear wheels when needed, while a more sophisticated driveline sourced from UK-based supplier GKN disconnects the propshaft when power to the rear wheels isn’t required, which helps improve fuel economy.


All the E-Pace’s engines are from JLR’s Ingenium family of four-cylinder, 2.0-liter powerplants.

This includes three diesels and two gasoline units. Jaguar wouldn’t say whether the E-Pace would get an electrified powertrain in the future.

The base engine is a 148-hp 2.0-liter diesel that emits 124 grams per kilometer of CO2, which is the lowest level offered by the E-Pace.

The top-performing engine is a gasoline unit that makes 296 hp and can take the E-Pace from 0 to 60 mph (96.7 kph) in 5.9 seconds.


At 4395mm, the E-Pace is slightly shorter than the X1 (4439mm) but very close in size to the Q3 (4388mm).

JLR’s Touch Pro infotainment system with a 10-inch screen is standard. A 12.3-inch screen is available as an option.

Also standard is a stereo camera that feeds information for the car’s active safety technology, including lane-keeping assistance, emergency braking and adaptive cruise control. The camera helps detect cars passing in front at obscured intersections.

The design of the car was created to make it look as sporty as possible, Callum said. That was helped by having short front and rear overhangs, a so-called “teardrop” shape made by the side windows, and large wheels up to 21-inches in size.
Richard Truett contributed to this report
I don’t know how they can build the car in China without electrifying it because of the Chinese government’s demand that a level of production must be.
 
#30 ·
I don’t know how they can build the car in China without electrifying it because of the Chinese government’s demand that a level of production must be.
- details, who cares about details - just look at the stunning design!

China isn't budging on 8% quota for EV, starting in months, and yet we in UK are fed this bilge about 100k+ Jaguar, when as you say its likely main market - the Evoque will kill it at birth in Europe/US - needs a PHEV or EV version.

But who cares, like most things in Britain, it's best to just keep one's mouth shut, and go with the mindless patriotic flow, even if it is over the approaching waterfall.
 
#38 ·
Magna is actually Canadian owned. Headquarters in Aurora Ontario. CEO is Canadian (like FCA). The Austrian plant is just a sideshow.

That Magna plant is a custom manufacturing (assembly really) plant very experienced in short runs and overflow production.

Magna also engineers awd systems but not your Jaguar which uses ZF products.
 
#41 ·
Just for example the current Golf E weighs 200 kg more than the non hybrid version and is much slower as a result.

It also costs more than GBP1000 more to buy.

There is no market for these hybrids as yet. Unless they can get the weight down and the price down only greenie weenie idiots will buy a hybrid.

Of course if IC power is banned significantly that would change matters, but the free market would still prefer IC only.

Just BTW, there is no indication that Magna will be assembling a hybrid version of the E Pace. In fact, many will be FWD IC power only, not even AWD.
 
#42 ·
As I said b******s, check out Jaguar's US XE sales numbers and compare them with their competitor BMW or Audi electric offerings.

Text Font Design Pattern Number


Also note the VW Golf e numbers, before the arrival of their latest model, the car with no market according to you.
Then check out the VW Golf e sales in Europe :)

E-Pace without an electric option and depending on diesel is crazy.

XE US sales 2017 numbers = right hand column:

January693
February993
March1.336
April742
May598764
June633638
July641
August901
September829
October941
November951
December1.162

Jaguar

XE
20166.656
Now spot the VW electric offering,with no market, in the country that really struggled to embrace EVs, Germany.

Text Font Line Parallel


More VW electric cars sold in June than all Jaguar models combined in the same month. No market indeed.
 
#45 ·
Is there a true market? Or is there merely a subsidised market? How many of these VW electric cars would have actually been sold if all the subsidies were removed?
 
#47 ·
You Jagular said:


Because there is no market for hybrid systems. Nobody wants to pay for them.



Presumably all of those deliveries of VW Golf e cars and other Hybrids, in all around 2500, in Germany in June were given away or stolen. I am prepared to believe that all those Ingenium engines were stolen the other month in Birmingham but not all of those cars in Germany :)

Give up and admit there is a market for Hybrid systems and one that Jaguar may need to embrace before the launch of their electric I-Pace if the E-Pace is to be a huge success.
 
#48 ·
Two questions: how many VWAG cars were sold in Germany in June of (whatever year you are talking about)? and how many of those hybrid cars were sold with no price supports at all. That means no price grant, no parking perks, no HOV lane perks, no fuel tax perks (they all get this one) and so on. I predict that the number of hybrid VW sold was less than 2% of VWAG sales and that each such sale was supported by some price support not offered for IC powered cars.

You need to give up. Hybrid cars are a no go unless regulation forces people to buy some. Even then the IC will have to be banned before any form of electrified vehicle will become at all popular. Even the modest target of 10% of total sales cannot be achieved without some sort of ban on the IC power.

As things are today only an idiot could be persuaded to buy a hybrid.
 
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